Bonus: Also features an in-depth video interview with the audio team - check it out here.
The warm, grainy look of Director Weston Razooli’s award-winning indie film Riddle of Fire (shot on Kodak 16mm film) brings to mind childhood adventure films like Goonies, The Neverending Story, or Hook but updated for the modern day. Told from the perspective of good-natured yet mischievous children, there’s an air of fantasy mixed into their mayhem, lending a charming quality to the story. Riddle of Fire premiered in the Directors’ Fortnight portion of the Cannes Film Festival and later screened at Toronto International Film Festival. It’s now available to rent or buy through VOD.
Here, supervising Sound Editor/Re-recording Mixer Garrard Whatley of Seismic Post Audio, Foley Artist Reece Miller, and Hamed Hokamzadeh, MPSE Studio Manager at MelodyGun – which provided all the foley, recorded ADR, and final mix – talk about designing sound to fit the nostalgic ’70s vibe of the film, finding inspiration in films of that era to guide their approach to creating and mixing backgrounds, creating foley sounds that portrayed the children’s experience of the world, working with production effects to keep the film feeling authentic and not overly polished, and so much more!
Also, check out the exclusive video interview with Garrard Whatley and Reece Miller on ‘Riddle of Fire,’ hosted by Steven Fine here
Riddle of Fire (2024) – Official Trailer
Riddle of Fire was shot on Kodak 16mm film and blown up to 35mm for screening at Cannes. It has this old-school ’80s film vibe with the film grain and color. How did this affect/impact your approach to the sound?
Garrard Whatley (GW): The first thing I noticed when Director Weston Razooli sent me the teaser he’d cut together was that it had very clearly been shot on film. Over the last few years, more and more short films had come through the studio that had been shot on “actual” film – and it felt so refreshing to see! I started my company in 1997, and film transfers to video were the usual delivery method back then. It slowly moved to QuickTime transfers, and then later sourced from digital footage and HD Cameras over time. And I have to say that seeing film again has been such a pleasure – it’s like an anomaly now! But it has mostly been in the realm of shorts, giving me the impression that these young filmmakers were experimenting with this not-so-ancient medium.
I remember feeling those ’70s mixes as very backgrounds-forward, with very rich and deep sounds drawing me into distant lands or unique locations.
So having an entire feature to work with that was so rich in saturation and contrast was exciting for Sound Designer Gary Zacuto and me to see. And to me, a lot of elements in the film, including costumes and hairstyles, harkened more to the 1970s. So we looked to films made in that era (as well as some early ’80s) to help populate this world with sound. I remember feeling those ’70s mixes as very backgrounds-forward, with very rich and deep sounds drawing me into distant lands or unique locations. And the fantasy-feel of this film lent itself well to making the backgrounds a major consideration and in fact, another character helping to tell the story. So I truly felt that leaning into the backgrounds, and including some fantastic elements woven in and out, was going to give the film a unique fingerprint.
It’s important to note, of course, that this film takes place in present time, but was made by a director that grew up on ’90s nostalgia, and makes clear evocations of the 1970s! So to me, targeting the decade 50 years ago was a natural move and felt right.
There needed to be a “smeariness” to the production sound to help further reflect the ’70s era we wanted to evoke…
Additionally, dealing with dialog and PFX (production effects) could add to this ’70s feel. As often as possible, I used the PFX as an element in scenes, along with the amazing foley provided by Reece, as well as the BGs, to give a messiness and reality to the world these children inhabited. I was able to save quite a lot of it thanks to different plug-ins and software that are available these days but it was important not to go too far or to get it too clean. There needed to be a “smeariness” to the production sound to help further reflect the ’70s era we wanted to evoke, and to feel as analog as possible.
The film is told from the perspective of a group of kids. How did that POV impact your approach to the foley – either in the choices of props for foley sounds, or your foley performance and miking techniques?
Hamed Hokamzadeh (HH): We used a Neumann KMR 81 as the main mic and a Sennheiser MKH 50 for the room mic pointed towards a wall. Kristopher Breckon, MelodyGun’s foley mixer, used a Focusrite 828 MKII on Pro Tools 2023 with EdiPrompt and Soundflow to speed things up during the recording process.
We were equally blown away by how much the film made us feel like kids again and that was the guiding principle…
Whenever a film comes in, I involve Reece and Kris and we discuss our thoughts on what the film needs, how many days we’ll need, etc. We were all blown away by how much movement the kids have! It’s not our first film with Garrard though where kids were involved, haha. We were equally blown away by how much the film made us feel like kids again and that was the guiding principle: be in the moment, don’t veer away, be subjective, and perform it as it feels to the kids in that moment. Sometimes in an adult-themed movie, we’ll do things like perform someone’s footsteps heavier, or reserved, and so on to capture their emotional state, but not in this film.
Reece Miller (RM): The film has a very authentic look and feel, and we knew that the foley needed to reflect that same sort of rough-around-the-edges timeless aesthetic. We tried to be as true to picture as possible, using actual dirt bikes, paintball guns, and truck parts to help the audience feel the weight of the items used by the characters on screen. Likewise, we used a lot of actual long grass, tree branches, and foliage to record the footsteps in the forest and field scenes. The foley room was an absolute mess.
The film stars a cast of mostly non-professional actors. How did that affect the performances that were recorded on the day? What about ADR? Did it take more time to do ADR with non-pro actors/kids? Can you talk about that process?
GW: Some of the children lived outside of California, so ADR was not a realistic option for them. We did get them to record some off-screen lines into cell phones that needed to be matched into scenes. A couple of the children did come in. But the truth is I always like to have someone who hasn’t done ADR before. That way I can teach them the right way to do it before they develop habits that aren’t helpful!
They would be twitchy in scenes sometimes or would make noises between lines, and I wanted to keep ALL of it!
And as for the non-professional aspect on location – that was part of the film’s charm! They would be twitchy in scenes sometimes or would make noises between lines, and I wanted to keep ALL of it! This was another good reason to do all that I could to keep the PFX because even the kids’ breaths and subtle mouth noises added to how much we felt this world from their perspective.
The character of Jodie was not easily understood while on set, and Weston recognized this on day one. He decided while shooting that he would simply subtitle the character throughout the film, and that too ended up having a positive impact on the child’s appeal! It was a great instinct on Weston’s part.
Exclusive Interview with Garrard Whatley and Reece Miller on ‘Riddle of Fire,’ hosted by Steven Fine
The film is shot pretty run-and-gun style, with the kids on dirt bikes, running through stores, and running through the woods! It looked like a challenging shoot. What were some techniques or tools that were useful in post for cleaning up the production sound?
GW: Amazingly, many noise reduction plugins have been developed since we completed this film. And while I have now used many of them on other films, I was happy to have fewer options when approaching the dialog and PFX on this film. It needed a lighter touch, and new tools sometimes get overused very quickly. I mostly utilized iZotope‘s Advanced noise reduction suite.
For dialog, where I could, I would use both boom and lav, correcting phase with SoundRadix Auto-Align Post 2…
For broadband noise, again I kept it lighter than usual, and would address the short-term noise issues by using Ambience Match to capture the background noise, then essentially ‘paint’ over each noise (be it a badly timed bird CAW or a branch snapping) by carefully selecting it and choosing “output Ambience Only” and rendering.
But I also give credit to the production sound recordists. There were boom and lavaliers available for every shot. For dialog, where I could, I would use both boom and lav, correcting phase with SoundRadix Auto-Align Post 2, EQ’ing some harshness out of the lavs with Fabfilter Pro-Q3 and McDSP’s SA-2 dialog processor.
For the PFX, I would typically use only the boom recordings, which are obviously going to be free of cloth hits and necklaces, etc., and they generally just needed a light broadband reduction. But the De-hum module definitely came in handy as well.
What was your biggest challenge in terms of sound editorial? Why?
GW: For many films, I can easily point to moments that were painful to try to fix but this film was always such a pleasure! I think the children made it so – seeing what we were able to uncover and underscore from them brought such joy to everyone.
The sounds they made – little breaths and ohs – were part of the wonder of the scene and the moment.
My most challenging scene in terms of editorial was one of the shortest scenes in the film, when the children go to retrieve an egg from the chicken. The entire time that the production had the location, there was a train going by, and a bell ringing constantly DING DING DING! They had a few lines of dialog, but I also wanted to save the PFX! The sounds they made – little breaths and ohs – were part of the wonder of the scene and the moment. Here, they had finally gotten their speckled egg! And on top of that, as mentioned, the two boys were unavailable for ADR. So it was going to be a matter of deliberately and carefully removing all of the train noises and bells, moment by moment, syllable by syllable, until we got both the dialog and PFX clean. It was all iZotope on that one. And patience!
What was your biggest challenge in terms of sound mixing? Why?
GW: Being a low-budget film, it was only the director Weston and I on the stage. In the film, I suppose a lot was going on from the end of the dance sequence through the chase and to the arrest, and while we were creatively prepared and premixed, there was a lot more for a single mixer to balance through that section technically.
But we do a lot of preparation before even getting to the stage…so that the mix stage time is more about balancing for the best way to tell the story theatrically.
But we do a lot of preparation before even getting to the stage, with Vimeo uploads and director approvals along the way, so that the mix stage time is more about balancing for the best way to tell the story theatrically. But high track counts in sections like that can be challenging, even when well-organized!
Do you have a favorite scene for sound? (Editorial-wise or mix-wise). What stands out for you sonically in this scene?
HH: My favorite scene is when the four kids go to grab the chicken behind the club and Jodie (played by Skyler Peters) says “what a turkey.” It just captures the off-the-cuff nature of the random stuff kids say, but also Garrard did a tremendous job cleaning the dialog in that scene because there was a loud train bell happening through the whole scene!
RM: My favorite scene has to be the gaming console heist that kicks off the film. From the moment we saw our gang of protagonists, it was a joy to set the mood for the adventure with dirt bikes, pressurized air canisters, paintball guns, and childish gadgets. Playing with the tension of the scene using the sounds of sneaking through towers of oversized boxes in a warehouse where our protagonists make a bold and charming escape was a very memorable part of the project for me.
GW: My favorite scene is the one right in the center, and what I consider to be the heart of the film. All of the kids sit in a meadow and talk a little about who they are and what they want. There is talk about parents who have passed away, difficult family lives, some comedy, a little love, and some hope. It’s their moment of respite in their wilderness journey, and each of them performs it so well.
…I love how it came out, all of the touches of the backgrounds, bits of wind, the foley of necklaces, and the sound of the children’s voices…
Sound-wise, it was challenging as there was a nearby highway, so I utilized a bit more noise reduction in certain moments but not across the board. I was concerned about maintaining the emotion, the feeling of togetherness, and the remoteness without stepping on the scene with noise reduction tools and the artifacts they can create. Such an error would take us out of the ’70s-era analog feel and distract the audience from this important emotional core.
In the end, I love how it came out, all of the touches of the backgrounds, bits of wind, the foley of necklaces, and the sound of the children’s voices, none of which were ADR’d. When I watch it now, I don’t even think about that nearby highway anymore, but instead get lost in the scene and its emotional intent.
What have you learned from your experience of working on the sound of Riddle of Fire?
HH: First and foremost, I think it’s a great example of how indie films should trust the director’s vision without exception. Weston Razooli made this film what it is and it’s brilliant because of his singular vision.
Don’t mistake the style of mix with lack of detail.
Second, details matter. I could see a version of this film starting post-production and thinking that they don’t need fully-filled M&E because it’s old-school and that’s part of the style to just use production sound for most of it. But often people in indie films confuse “style” with lack of sound. Even in a found-footage horror film, you need every foley detail; it’s just mixed differently. Don’t mistake the style of mix with lack of detail.
Thirdly, a music supervisor is one of the most underutilized creative for indie filmmakers. The choice to have pre-existing music in this film made the nostalgia real and I can’t imagine a custom-score having the same effect.
RM: Many of the props I needed to use to record the foley couldn’t fit into our stage, so learning to record effects in less-than-ideal audio environments like garages or alleyways was something I had to learn to do. Lots of movable deadening blankets, absorbent foam, and creative mic placement happened to get the sounds we needed. I also usually don’t use as many authentic props as I did with Riddle, and it was very satisfying to have the real richness of those items come together in the mix.
In films I’ve worked on since, I would say I’ve opened my mind up more to this type of improvised music editorial…
GW: We veered away from some “standards” in this film (not that I overly rely on aesthetic standards, but there are some common conventions in film mixing to consider). In this case, we’d more often than not shy away from having musical downbeats or score start-points be strictly on the cuts to new scenes, but instead, we would offset it a bit (or more). Weston acted as his own music editor, so this was intrinsic I think to his sensibility. I think it resulted in the music reflecting and supporting the quirky nature and off-beat rhythms of childhood. But in general, the music here was a bit more esoteric and supportive, acting almost like BGs. It was a subtle thing about this film that I hadn’t engaged in deeply before – but then again most films don’t have this style of music that can dance in and out like this, leaving options on the stage to move things around. In films I’ve worked on since, I would say I’ve opened my mind up more to this type of improvised music editorial and working with the composer and director to help steer the emotion of the story or a comedic impact in a new direction by doing so.
Lastly, having a great team is always such an amazing pleasure. Sound Designer Gary Zacuto did fantastic work, and Hamed and Reece at MelodyGun are absolutely amazing artists. I feel very lucky to be involved with all of them on this film and many others we’ve done. I love that we all got to work on a feature that was shot on actual film, and create a world of sound that feels right at home in that analog and emulsion, even while using digital tools to achieve it. It is a wonderful feeling knowing that we can lean into these historical sound ideas successfully using today’s tools, and create an evocative environment that, although set today, speaks to us from the past.
A big thanks to Garrard Whatley, Reece Miller, and Hamed Hokamzadeh for giving us a behind-the-scenes look at the sound of Riddle of Fire and to Jennifer Walden for the interview!