Achieving Articulate Chaos on ‘American Primeval’ using the Rolling Mix Method – with Wylie Stateman and Anne Jimkes-Root

Director Peter Berg's American Primeval – now streaming on Netflix – portrays the grim history of the birth of the American West through the violent collisions of men and women of different creeds and cultures, fighting for control. Here, sound designer Wylie Stateman and supervising sound editor/music editor Anne Jimkes-Root talk about their 'rolling mix' approach to building the soundtrack in tandem with picture editorial to craft an articulate, orchestrated sound with dialogue, music, and effects working cohesively. They talk about their intentional approach to designing chaos, using production sound to create authentic backgrounds, embracing AI sound tools to 'unshade' overlapping tracks, and more!

---

Interview by Jennifer Walden, photos courtesy of Netflix; Wylie Stateman; Munaf Rayani; Lee Sobel

---

Please share:

• More

Netflix’s American Primeval limited series, directed by Peter Berg, is an unflinching tale of the birth of the American West. Violence, greed, and clashes between cultures and religious beliefs compound the daily hardships of surviving in this unforgiving environment. According to the show’s sound designer Wylie Stateman, Berg didn’t want to make a typical Western with a sweeping orchestra score. Instead, the tone is set by the score from the Austin, TX post-rock band Explosions in the Sky. Berg wanted to take an unapologetic musical approach that had dark intensity, pulse, and hypnotic rhythms. Supervising sound editor/music editor Anne Jimkes-Root began work early on the show as musical liaison between the band and the cutting room, since music was the foundation not only for the picture edits but also for the overall soundtrack including dialogue and effects.

The American Primeval sound editorial team: Elliot Hartley, Anne Jimkes-Root, Wylie Stateman, Trevor Cress, Lee Sobel, and Biko Gogaladzeis, is currently in the running for an Emmy nomination for “OUTSTANDING SOUND EDITING FOR A LIMITED OR ANTHOLOGY SERIES, MOVIE OR SPECIAL” for their sound work on “Episode 6.”

Here, Stateman and Jimkes-Root — at Soundelux — talk about begin involved at every step of the process (from script to final mix), and they explain their “Rolling Mix” process that helped to shape the show’s sound as the picture was being edited. They also discuss their approach to creating the sound of organized chaos for Fort Bridger, designing the sound of battle scenes, using as much production sound as possible to maintain authenticity, and much more.

American Primeval | Official Trailer | Netflix

American Primeval sounds amazing! When did you get involved with the show? And what were the first things you wanted to tackle?

Sound Designer Wylie Stateman

Wylie Stateman (WS): Working on a Netflix limited series requires focus; there is no such thing as unlimited time. We start with the script. An hour of scripted material is generally about four hours of reading and taking notes. The script becomes the foundation for understanding creative intention, drama, and, of course, action. From the script, we render an action outline that informs the show’s needs in terms of sound.

For American Primeval, director Peter Berg’s script set the tone for what could be a raw and visceral sound mix. We’re lucky that Pete is an actor, writer, director, and producer – an actors’ director, who is highly accomplished at working closely with all aspects of picture and sound. Pete appreciates creative action, story-driven problem-solving, especially when it comes to dialogue, music, and sound effects.

Throughout American Primeval‘s post-production, the sound editorial team was assembling ideas in a single Pro Tools mix session. It’s an ever-evolving “Rolling Mix.” We are always editing dialogue, music, and effects, and balancing them against each other. This thought process has deeply informed our creative workflow. Anne has really helped to champion the Rolling Mix.

Sound Supervisor/Music Editor
Anne Jimkes-Root

Anne Jimkes-Root (AJR): As soon as two shots have been cut together, we start building and balancing the mix. We make sound kits for the picture editors so that they (and the assistant editors) can start working with material curated from our extensive sound library. The editor’s cut is a great way to explore and ultimately refine the project’s sonic pace and vocabulary.

WS: The Avid is not a proxy for something that will be recreated by the sound team in the last three weeks of post-production. The Avid track ultimately becomes the final soundtrack. The Avid mix is the mix. The Pro Tools super session is the final session; it begins on day one of the picture edit.

We get our sound in front of the director and move forward based on the response we receive. Early in this process, the director is starting to imagine where the music is going to start, and that’s hugely important to the overall experience of any soundtrack. Where music starts, climaxes, and finishes informs the cut. The director and editor can start thinking about, “Can we lose some of the ride up, or the ride away? It’s beautiful to look at, and it’s musical now, and, you know what, we’d rather sacrifice something somewhere else.”
 

Left: Munaf Rayani (Explosions in the Sky/EIIS), Middle: Jeffery Byrd (EITS Sound Engineer), Right: Micheal James (EIIS); Photo by Munaf Rayani

Speaking of music, it sounds like this “Rolling Mix” process requires you to be deeply involved in both sound and score. How did you approach that?

AJR: Peter Berg knew from the beginning that he wanted to work with the talented American post-rock band Explosions in the Sky. Their sound is derived from their three guitarists (and occasionally keyboardists) – Michael James, Munaf Rayani, and Mark Smith – and percussionist, Chris Hrasky. Together, they create these hypnotic, wordless jams that rely entirely on mood, rhythm, and texture. They scored Friday Night Lights; that’s how Pete fell in love with them.

Anne Jimes-Root during recording sessions at Lucy’s Meat Market in Eagle Rock; Photo by Munaf Rayani

I became the liaison between Explosions and the cutting room. From the very start, I was building little mixes for individual scenes, focusing on the music, but also touching the dialogue here and there when it was helpful for the picture editors.

WS: Before there was any edited footage available, Explosions began to produce musical suites, exploring a range of unique musical ideas specifically catered to Pete’s story. This early establishment of our musical palette created a bridge between the pacing of picture and sound for editorial.

AJR: We spoke with Pete using his keywords, like “pulse,” “propulsion,” “anxiety,” “darkness,” and “violence.” Those words became key focal points with music.

Then, as scenes and sequences became available from editors Hugo Diaz, Jon Otazua, and Art Jones, I was able to reshape the suites from Explosions to inform additional thematic ideas and the musical pulse of the story. That pulse became the through line for the whole series. It was expressed in different instrumentations (e.g., a kick drum or a bass string) and was introduced at the beginning of the first episode when Fry arrives at the train station to pick up Sara and Devin. From there, the thematic pulse continues to evolve as we traverse all six episodes.

Left: Mark T. Smith (EITS), Right: George Drakoulias (Music Supervisor); Photo by Munaf Rayani

WS: Pete didn’t want to make a Western; his story was to be one of survival set in the American West. The history of the Western has largely been defined by Big Sky beauty shots and traditional symphonic score. As our fate would have it, Pete wanted dark intensity, pulse, hypnotic rhythms, and an unapologetic musical approach to this type of story. It was very exciting. Sound effects then become an additive process – we need a burst of physical violence, or horse sounds, or gore, or fist fights, or gun violence, or just toe-to-toe dialogue. All soundtrack elements are placed with music in mind. The dialogue, music, and sound effects can then be orchestrated and refined together.

AJR: There’s a lot of leaning into each other’s worlds and blurring the lines between music and sound effects design. Explosions creates truly novel guitar effects and textures. The music suites they produced contained dramatic layers of creature-like noises and wailing sounds that blend in perfectly with the backgrounds.
 

WS: We’re blending music and sound design into the inhospitable environments, the cold winds, birdless mountain meadows, and snowfields.

AJR: The stark, unsettling crow sounds, distant elk, background bumps and bangs, all were added as part of the accompanying sound effects design.

You can definitely hear that, particularly when it goes into a subjective POV, like in Ep. 1 when Jacob wakes up from nearly being scalped and he’s having that flashback of the previous night. The music and sound design in that headspace fit hand-in-glove. They’re indistinguishable…

WS: Hand-in-glove, that’s how deliberate sound design should be. That is the essence of the style that we bring to these projects. We look to promote a seamless flow. The dialogue, it magically becomes music, becomes sound design, becomes sound effects, becomes dialogue again. They all hand off in beautiful or simple rhythms or pulses or at times shocking discontinuity.

Sometimes the most difficult aspect to achieve for any sound mix is for it to sound/feel unexpected and broken, to show the sharp, well-defined, irregular edges.

AJR: It’s all being developed while keeping an eye on the novel idea that is best established early on as we read scripts and speak with the director and fellow creatives. In this case, the novel idea was to embrace the rough edges of the mix with confidence and boldness, to pursue this raw authenticity, reflecting the harsh environments and the very violent consequences of all the character-driven difficult decisions.

WS: Sometimes the most difficult aspect to achieve for any sound mix is for it to sound/feel unexpected and broken, to show the sharp, well-defined, irregular edges. One way to do that is to counterbalance the rawness with something beautiful and lyrical — a handoff from a melodic phrase to a jagged, rough stab or punch. It’s creating something and then breaking it, and then creating and breaking; that cycle makes a soundtrack interesting.
 

That can be heard in the battle scenes. You have this incredible feeling of chaos, but it’s so well orchestrated. By the way, the arrow sounds in the show are amazing. They sound incredible…

WS: These days, everyone has access to great sound effects. You can go to A Sound Effect‘s website and find the most beautiful recordings on any subject. The world of sound effects is now populated by so many contributors, so many people giving their best work in terms of recording and cataloging sounds. The challenge for the sound designer, editor, and mixer is to create a soundtrack that is uncluttered. The Japanese have a word for it, “wabi-sabi.” It’s a philosophy that embraces both imperfection and simplicity. In our case, it meant seeing the beauty in jagged, unexpected, random edges and imperfections.

We sculpt the mix to be a rapid succession of these ideas. Your brain is not great at processing a lot of sounds at the same time, but it’s very good at recognizing new sounds and rhythm breaks in rapid sequence.

AJR: That’s where the Rolling Mix is so powerful. Every time we receive a scene back from the cutting room, we reevaluate which moments can be driven by music and which moments should have the music take a step back, allowing for these arrows and the sharp slicing of a blade to come through clearly and boldly. We sculpt the mix to be a rapid succession of these ideas. Your brain is not great at processing a lot of sounds at the same time, but it’s very good at recognizing new sounds and rhythm breaks in rapid sequence.

WS: Sound people succeed when they create a path for the listener, for the audience, to follow through the story. Picture and sound can work together or independently of one another. Beauty, in terms of sound, is beholden to its own vocabulary and its own ability to string together ideas using nothing more than starts, stops, and creative edits.

Sound differs from image in that it needs to be, as Anne said, much simpler because our brain appreciates that. Once you make a mix, you’ve tied those layers together, and your mind can’t untie them. You can pick a single item on the screen to focus on visually, but listening to one single element of a sound mix is practically impossible. So, it’s best to become vigilant, conscious of those relative balances between dialogue, music, and effects. Our brain can handle speed, clarity, and detail, but not deep overlapping layers of things masking the core idea we’re trying to convey.

What I appreciate the most about this show is how much detail you put into the backgrounds. For example, in Fort Bridger, you hear this vibrant world happening offscreen, and although it seems like sounds are coming from everywhere all the time, if you really listen, you can hear an individual sound come in and move through the space, and then another sound will come in and move through the space. There’s always something happening, but it’s a handoff of sounds instead of overlapping sounds…

WS: We take what we call the “parade” approach. Everything going by your eyes has to have its moment, and then it has to go away so that the next thing can have its moment.

The whole purpose of this clarity-type approach that Anne was talking about is that your brain can accept these things happening quickly, but it can’t accept them having too many overlapping layers that your ears can’t unwind.

AJR: We use the different tools at our disposal to determine how the ideas or events are presented in that parade and the fluid handoffs between them. That’s modulating through changes in volume. That’s tinkering with EQ. That’s playing with panning. It’s a combination of processes. FabFilter Pro-Q allows us to use, for example, a dialogue side chain that we can not only apply to music, which is a more traditional way of using it, but also have the music and effects react to each other.

Wylie Stateman and Austin Roth (Re-recording Mixer) on the mixing stage in Topanga; Photo by Lee Sobel

Additionally, we use tools like Oeksound’s Soothe2, which is a more gentle resonance suppressor as opposed to an EQ.

It’s very much a case-by-case basis in terms of choosing what is more effective for that moment. And the Rolling Mix workflow provides us with the time to experiment with these tools.

WS: There are AI tools that do unshading really effectively. You can take a piece of music and a piece of dialogue, and have the tool identify and unshade the frequencies in the music that are competing with the dialogue. It can do that so quickly that it would be impractical or impossible to do any other way. The idea of unshading one track against the other is something that is part of the new frontier. You can remove frequencies in a guitar track, let’s say, that are conflicting with the dialogue as the dialogue modulates. So, it’s not a global application. It’s a precision move that you can identify and steer through adaptive, frequency-specific shading.

Fort Bridger is all mud and blood, so lots of squishy/squashy sounds. Was it difficult to get clarity in the effects in the mix?

WS: When it’s squishy/squashy, you hear it clearly right in your face, but as soon as the next idea needs to be presented, then the squishy or squashy sounds are gone. They aren’t playing low underneath it. Since it’s a parade of sounds, those sounds are replaced by the next sound on parade.

AJR: Fort Bridger, in particular, was meant to feel like a dense orchestrated form of chaos. The project’s co-supervising sound editor, Elliot Hartley, played a big role in shaping that environment — weaving the voices from the people speaking different languages, interacting with animals and with each other, and getting into fights. All of this unfolds around Sara and Bridger as they’re walking through, giving the place a tense, lived-in texture.

There’s no unnecessary clutter in the track. ‘American Primeval’ represents our best effort at achieving a ‘wabi-sabi’ soundtrack.

Our re-recording mixers Austin Roth and Trevor Cress, both did a lot of the effects building. Austin was our horse master. He conducted a whole study on every part of a horse you can think of. Trevor focused on shaping the world in which our story takes place, such as through different types of wind, weather, and hostile backgrounds that communicate this idea of extreme cold that our characters were navigating through on their journey, and while being chased.

WS: Everybody was on the same page when it came to wanting lots of clarity and interesting detail, but not a lot of things layering over another. The style of American Primeval is exactly what you experienced, which is that things pop out when we want them to pop out, and tell the story basically in this parade-type of sensibility. There’s no unnecessary clutter in the track. American Primeval represents our best effort at achieving a “wabi-sabi” soundtrack.

It’s “ABC – always be cutting.” And “ABM – always be mixing.” And “ABI – always be imagining, or innovating.”
 

Can you tell me about your loop group/walla? That’s such a great part of these backgrounds; you hear different voices, different languages…

WS: Much of it is sourced from production or libraries. We want a voice here and a voice there, like when the Mormon Militia walks through Fort Bridger with their torches to burn down the fort. Jim Bridger’s farewell speech to the drunken crowd was recorded “clean” and without yelling in the background. However, sprinkling in the instructions coming from the outside added extra emotion, weight, and pressure to Bridger’s parting words.

We want a voice here and a voice there, like when the Mormon Militia walks through Fort Bridger with their torches to burn down the fort.

AJR: Aside from that sequence, there were only a few very specific moments where Elliot recorded original loop group material. Other examples are the creepy French Canadian family and moments with the Shoshone, Paiute, and Ute people, working with language consultants for the latter.
 

The voices and callouts you can hear clearly in the background, were those scripted lines?

WS: There are surprisingly few of those. Many of them, particularly in the Shoshone village, were taken from the production sound, recorded by our talented production sound mixer Jason Pinney. He was very kind in getting us bits of things that were appropriate for the different groups of people: military people, Mormons, Shoshone, and other tribes. This is really a story of the merging of these people and their journeys.

The material from production included several powwow moments at the Shoshone village, where there’s a drum group playing.

AJR: The material from production included several powwow moments at the Shoshone village, where there’s a drum group playing. That’s an actual Shoshone group called Big Wind Drum Group. They came on set and performed; it was captured and preserved as part of the mix, and further enhanced for the story with material from Explosions. But it was important to keep that level of authenticity.
 

In Ep. 6, Fort Bridger burns down. The patrons in the saloon are getting drunk and singing as the establishment burns down around them. Can you tell me about the sound work for this scene?

WS: We got the singing from production. It was intentional that it sounded like non-professional drunken singing. We wanted the characters to have the opportunity to contribute that feeling.

We get a lot of valuable stuff directly from the production or production outtakes because of Pete’s considerable efforts.

We often work with production in a collaborative way. We asked, “If we’re not generally using take one, can you have everybody sing in full voice?” It really helps inform the noise floor that the principal actors will have to talk over. Pete Berg is really the reason why that happens. That’s why I say he’s an actors’ director. He understands actors and knows how to get them motivated, frothed, and into character. We get a lot of valuable stuff directly from the production or production outtakes because of Pete’s considerable efforts.
 

Wylie Stateman at Runty’s skinning post, on set of ‘American Primeval’

Did you get a chance to go out to the filming locations and record sounds and props on set, similar to what you’d done on Godless?

WS: We did. Although with Godless, we literally camped on the set for days after the first unit finished shooting. For American Primeval, weather was always a factor. We spent some time in Fort Bridger when the production was shooting in another location 100 miles away. Being on set is really valuable and benefits the overall understanding of the project.

The challenge with American Primeval was to make all the backgrounds super stark. There is little indication of any out-of-frame life, no tweety, happy birds. No “Western” cliches.
 

‘American Primeval’ Executive Producer/Director Peter Berg

There’s obviously a lot of trust and respect in your collaboration on Peter Berg’s projects. In an interview for WNYC, he called you, Wylie, “a mad genius sound designer” and “a real sound artist.”

WS: We’ve learned to serve wisely, to get inside of what Pete wants to accomplish as a filmmaker; our whole sound crew has. We function as a team. The journey for sound is deliberate, a team sport, from script to screen, and sometimes more than 20 languages on service for Netflix.
 

What did you learn while working on the sound of American Primeval? Or, what’s stuck with you from your experience of working on the show?

this taught me to have faith in the process of an additive mix rather than a deductive mix

WS: I would say this taught me to have faith in the process of an additive mix rather than a deductive mix, and to have faith in the filmmakers, and to be a filmmaker — to always think about the process from the audience’s point of view. That’s what makes you a filmmaker. It’s not an ego exercise. It’s really, “Can I look at something in a fresh way? Can I think about how this is going to be experienced by a first-time viewer/listener?” As Anne said, “to think like a filmmaker, to act like a producer, and to decisively communicate ideas and responsibilities to the wider filmmaking team.”

What did I learn? I learned that I still love doing this.

A big thanks to Wylie Stateman and Anne Jimkes-Root for giving us a behind-the-scenes look at the sound of American Primeval and to Jennifer Walden for the interview!

Please share this: